Brew Temp

[David23]

I am trying out some Blue Bottle Heyes Valley beans, and they suggest 192 degrees at the portafilter. Chris Coffee says the offset on our machines is preset so that the indicated temperature on the panel is the temp at the group. So how do I get to 192 at the portafilter? I assume the group and portafilter temps are different? Does the temp cool a bit from the group to the portafilter? How much? Thoughts?

[Endo]

I assume what they say for the bean brew temp is actually the temperature of the water going through the puck. This is also the same as the set temperature on the VIvaldi (assuming it was calibrated and you use two 2oz warming flushes.

In other words, just set it to 192F (or 89C). Although this does seem like a rather low temperature to me. You'll need to use the expanded scale option to get down that low. Personally, I wouldn't bother. I just set it at it's lowest point (91C) and skip the warming shots.

[JohnB]

I assume what they say for the bean brew temp is actually the temperature of the water going through the puck. This is also the same as the set temperature on the VIvaldi (assuming it was calibrated and you use two 2oz warming flushes.

In other words, just set it to 192F (or 89C). Although this does seem like a rather low temperature to me. You'll need to use the expanded scale option to get down that low. Personally, I wouldn't bother. I just set it at it's lowest point (91C) and skip the warming shots.

Depending on how well your offset is adjusted 1 2oz flush should get you in the ballpark. What's the point of having the expanded temp range if you don't use it?? I've pulled shots at 88C exploring different flavors in my s/o espresso.

[David23]

I'll try the 91 setting and see how it tastes. Bitter is too hot, sour too cool (I realize this is a simplification) correct? I should be able to dial it in.
Have you tried any of Blue Bottle Beans?

[Endo]

Traditional wisdom is that light roasts are hotter, dark roasts are cooler. But there are some recent exceptions.

I'm not a big "temperature tweaker". I'm usually happy if I get it within +/- 2 deg C. That's the tolerance on my taste buds. Some professional cuppers say they can taste +/- 1 deg C. I'd worry more about getting the dose right since this will have a bigger impact than 1 deg C. Do you know what they recommend as a dose?

Never tried the Blue Bottle beans but from the description, it sounds like my type of blend (American Style).

[David23]

Well I just pulled a shot (double) of the BB Heyes Valley, and it was wonderful. I just set the panel to 91C and waited about 45 mins for the temp to even out, then did my usual routine. Beautiful color, nice striping, thin trail, 1.3-4 oz in 25 sec. Probably the best tasting as well as best looking shot I have pulled since buying the machine.

I have been a little reluctant to experiment much with temps in the past, and perhaps in retrospect that could be why my shots have never tasted quite as good as this one. Im going to try and be more flexible from now on. THis was a rather eye opening moment.

[JohnB]

I have been a little reluctant to experiment much with temps in the past, and perhaps in retrospect that could be why my shots have never tasted quite as good as this one. Im going to try and be more flexible from now on. THis was a rather eye opening moment.

Glad to hear it! No point in owning a machine like the Vivaldi if you don't play around with the brew temps & see what different flavors you can bring out. I don't buy into the "light roast hot & dark roast cool" theory as it hasn't worked out that way for me. Terroir's light roasted espressos taste best at 88c-92c & I'm pulling shots from a blend roasted to Full City+/Vienna that tastes much better at 94c then it does at 91-92C.

[Endo]

I don't buy into the "light roast hot & dark roast cool" theory as it hasn't worked out that way for me. Terroir's light roasted espressos taste best at 88c-92c.

It's still a good "rule of thumb". Terroir is one of the exceptions I mentioned.

[JohnB]

It's still a good "rule of thumb". Terroir is one of the exceptions I mentioned.

As I said it hasn't worked well for me, so no I don't consider it a good rule to live by. Do your own experimenting & don't just stick with one temp until you've tried the bean/blend over a 3-4°C range to see what YOU like best.

[Endo]

There are quite a few new atrisinal roasters in the US who are breaking this rule. It may be simply a matter of a trend towards an expanded roast range (roasters are trying new things), in order to develop a unique taste.

In all cases, there is lots of info (usually on their website or on the bag) for the optimum brewing temperature (as they intended it). So if you are going with something from Terroir, Intelligensia, Blue Bottle, etc, there is seldom a need to guess.

But if you do need to guess, the "rule of thumb" is a good place to start.

[JohnB]

I gave up asking roasters for their dose/temp recommendations as aside from Terroir it was always the same. Huge 19-21 gram doses may be what they want to drink/serve but it doesn't work for me. When you're pulling 14-15g shots with blends designed for mega dosing following their temp recommendations is no guarantee. Start in the middle (93C), then pull a shot hotter & one cooler. See which you prefer, fine tune from there. Personally I don't want every shot to taste like chocolate so I use the mid & cool temp range much more then the hotter temps.